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Bienvenue sur Wikipédia, Kvitenol !
Bonjour, je suis Moumou82, rédacteur de Wikipédia.
Wikipédia est une formidable aventure collective, toujours en construction. La version francophone comporte aujourd'hui 2 616 498 articles, rédigés par des bénévoles comme vous et moi.
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Moumou82 6 juillet 2013 à 12:27 (CEST)
File:Br.Chilia1865.jpg & File:Moldova1483.jpg modifier
File:Br.Chilia1865.jpg : Здравствуйте! По файлу видно, что он является частью карты Parte din Harta Principatelor Unite ale României de Pr. George Filipescu-Dubău şi Anton Parteni-Antonin, Iaşi 1865 Сама карта называется: Harta Principatelor Unite ale României de Pr. George Filipescu-Dubău şi Anton Parteni-Antonin, Iaşi 1865 Как она выглядит? И важны условные обозначения к ней. Так, к примеру, озеро Катлабух --- почему-то называется L. Rasuna(???); и названия населенных пунктов вокруг него...: Ismail (Тuscova), Doluchioi, Kisliza, Navodari (???), Zaharesti (???), Catlabuga.... Там, где вопросы, существовали и существуют озеро и населенные пункты совсем с другими названиями. Там на карте отображены как действительно существовавшие и существующие населенные пункты, так и названия, непонятно как там появившиеся. Возле населенных пунктов там трех'-четырех'-значные числа. Что они означают? Как вглядит эта карта полностью? Где (в каких изданиях, атласах...) она публиковалась? Какие еще сведения по этой территории могут быть у Вас ? Заранее спасибо
- Здравствуйте dear Kvitenol-94745006.
- Harta Principatelor Unite ale României from Pr. George Filipescu-Dubău & Anton Parteni-Antonin, Iaşi 1865, and showed the historic Translvania, Moldavia, Wallachia & Dobruja. I don't know if it was published because I think is only a headquarters & state tool. It have 54 sheets, each one dimension 18 x 25 cm. Some concerning Moldavia (4, 5, 6, 7, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 32, 33, 34, 35 & 36), others concerning the statistic data (44, 45, 53 & 54) and between the first ones, Bukovina is showed on 4, 5, 13 & 14 sheets, russian Bessarabia is showed on 5, 6, 7, 15, 16, 17, 25, 26, 27, 34, 35 @ 36. Rivers, relief & names are in black, limits of округи (judeţe : counties) & borders in colour. Austrian empire borders are yellow, Russian empire borders are green, United Prinipalities borders are pink but each county have its colour. The names are sometimes different in front of the later or actual names, but identic with the oldest names (by example on the Descriptio antiqui et hodierni status Moldaviae from Dimitrie Cantemir, written & drawed in Russia for the academy of Berlin 1714-1716 : Rasuna is the moldavian name of the tatar Qatlapuh (today Катлабух), Oblucitsa the moldavian name of turkish Ismail (russian Тushkov, in romanian script Tuscova), etc... The numbers near the villages are the habitants.
- File:Moldova1483.jpg : I was one of the collaborators for this work but you can delete this one (a rough copy) because the GOOD and final version is : File:Moldova (1483)-en.png on http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Moldova_%281483%29-en.png by ro:Utilizator:Andrein
-en.png){kind=link}
- The округи (judeţe : Кырлигэтура - moldavian Cârligătura, and others counties) have sometimes change their areas & names in the flood of time. Is it easy to merge the years between the different sources. Wishes, --Spiridon Ion Cepleanu (d) 7 juillet 2013 à 16:19 (CEST)
- Здравствуйте (2), Kvitenol-94745006
"Harta Principatelor Unite ale României de Pr. George Filipescu-Dubău și Anton Parteni-Antonin, Iași 1865" is not an atlas but a leather box containing 9 series of 6 sheets each; the sheets are printing on an old strong paper and glued on a tissue. The tissue is fold. This box belong to the library of the Romanian studies institute of Paris IV University (La Sorbonne) and I photocopied some of these maps thirty-five years ago.
About the villages and towns, they have many changing names. Some names are only in the Cantemir's Descriptio Moldaviae map. Some others are in the Cantemir's AND on the George Filipescu-Dubău & Anton Parteni-Antonin map, but disappear after this. Some others persisted on the XIX-th century german maps (Stieler's atlas) and disappear after 1880. Some others again are identic in all the sources. For examle: Oblucitsa is the moldovan name (only in Cantemir) for Ismail (Turkish name); after 1812 the Russian Empire gived the name of Tushkov; after 1856 the Moldavian authorities wrote it Tuscova but în 1878 the Russian Empire prefers Izmail and Romanian Kingdom also, between 1918 and 1940. Another example: Frumoasa is the moldovan name of Kagul, in Cantemir, in Filipescu-Dubău & Parteni-Antonin, in Stielers, but disappear after 1890. Romanian Kingdom wrote it as Cahul. Moldova also. Why disappear the old moldavian names, as Frumoasa, Zaharesti or Navodari? Because the moldavian population was gone in the XIX century, and other populations (germans, bulgarians, gagauz, russian) comed. Also because the Russian authorities take, when they create the first geographic lists of names, allways the Tatar or Turkish name, never the Moldavian one. So were the situation in 1904 when Zamfir Arbore wrote his Dictionar Geografic al Basarabiei (see Dictionar Geografic al Basarabiei an. 1904 de Zamfir Arbore). He have not, in this moment, knowledge about the older maps ans names. In 1918 the Romanian Kingdom take the Russian lists, and changed some names on a military way, not an intellectual one : only when the name were difficult to saying in Romanian (as Sekerli-Kitai --> Regele Carol II) and without any study about the older names of the places.
The Dobrujan Navodari ([1]) is only one of the three Navodari (see also [2]). Navod means Рыболовная сеть.
The men who have many sources about the old moldovan names are, in Kishinev, the Pr. Anatol Eremia from the Akademia Nauk of Moldovan Republic, and in the Romanian Moldavia, the Pr. Alexandru Zub of the Xenopol Institute of Iasi. I hope they are alive again. Many reproductions of old maps are today accessible by internet. I supose than the Filipescu-Dubău & Parteni-Antonin map exists on the great libraries of Romania, in the military historic Museum, in the Romanian Academy... For my side, I can scan and send to you my copies, but please write to me in French or English because my Russian is very bad and I must ask help to my russian friends for understand you. My mail is mernature@mer-nature.org, give me yours if you want to receive the scans. But in Septembre, because in this summer I have many many late in my works.
Have a nice day, --Spiridon Ion Cepleanu (d) 19 juillet 2013 à 20:49 (CEST)
- Hello ! The principality of Moldavia was divided in Tinuturi (shires), divided in Ocoluri (counties), divided in Enorii (parishes). Later (XIX cent.) the « Tinuturi » became Judete (later Krai in the russian Bessarabia), the « Ocoluri » became Plasi (later Okrug in Bessarabia, later again Rayon in USSR), and the « Enorii » became Comune (Selo in Bessarabia, later again Rural sovet in USSR).
Cotnari are the name of a famous wineyard (vinogradoe) & wine in the Cârligatura Tinut/Judet.
Wishes, --Spiridon Ion Cepleanu (d) 28 juillet 2013 à 18:23 (CEST)
Salebot a annulé votre modification sur Discussion utilisateur:Spiridon Ion Cepleanu modifier
Bonjour, Kvitenol,
Vous avez découvert comme il est facile de modifier l’encyclopédie Wikipédia.
Je suis Salebot, un bot (un programme informatique entièrement automatisé) de lutte contre le vandalisme qui surveille toutes les modifications. J'ai analysé votre modification, je l'ai classée comme suspecte, et je l'ai donc annulée.
Si j'ai fait une erreur, vous pouvez défaire ma modification (lisez Aide:Révocation pour comment faire). Vous pouvez également signaler le problème sur ma page de discussion, qui est suivie par des participants à l'encyclopédie. Pour qu'ils comprennent de quelle modification il s'agit, indiquez le diff : http://fr.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=95414134&oldid=95414084&rcid=100366036 (vous pouvez le copier-coller).
Vos modifications constructives sont les bienvenues ! Pour vous aider, vous pouvez consulter le livret d'aide et la boussole du contributeur débutant.
J'ai détecté : Longue section sans minuscules ; Longue section sans majuscules ; Petite différence de taille.
--Salebot (bot de maintenance) (d) 30 juillet 2013 à 19:13 (CEST)
C'est OK avec Kvitenol, tout va bien Salebot ! ;-) modifier
Hi Kvitenol. The village of Cotnari are in the Hârlau county, but the "Cotnari wineyard" are larger, on the Hârlau & Cârligatura counties as in the map [3] ([4] by Andrein [5]). Probably the main sources for his map are the old maps of Principality of Moldavia (XVI, XVII & XVIII centuries), here [6] and in the Giurescu, Negrea, Petrenco, Constantiniu, Xenopol, Zub and other moldovan & romanian modern books. See also [7]... --Spiridon Ion Cepleanu (d) 30 juillet 2013 à 21:29 (CEST)